Curse

Slowpokeking · Aug 03, 2011, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZephyLynx

It seems to me that the OP is simply making a case for prot prayers not being good in DoA. Pretty much every example of prot being outclassed is made about DoA. Ok, you made a valid point that prot monks are not as good in DoA as ST/Imba, but this does NOT mean that prot monks need buffing.

You seem to harp on and give examples exclusively about the ELITE area DoA. That area is not designed for beginners. That area is hard for a reason, and not all builds work well.

Take MM for example. MM's are very useful in general PvE, they soak up damage, provide a wall, and can explode. However, in another (more difficult that general play) area such as FoW, they are not very useful at all. However, I don't think that mm's should be buffed just so they can be used effectively in FoW.

Fire magic is terrible against the destroyers. Should we buff fire magic (on that reason alone)?

All the afflicted rangers carry blind. Should warriors/assassins/dervishes be buffed to have blind resistance/immunity?

I play prot/hybrid monk all the time. In general, I have never really had any problems at all. I don't believe that prot prayers is underpowered at all. For GENERAL PLAY, prot prayers brings much utility (and the ability to hybrid) when ST/Imba cannot. ST/Imba cannot really remove conditions, hexes, or heal like a monk can. ST/Imba are specialized builds, whereas a hybrid monk has much more versatility.

In GENERAL PLAY, there is not THAT much enchant removal. Skills should not be balanced around elite areas.

Another point is that ST/Imba are fairly mindless builds. Mash skills on recharge is basically what it comes down to. However, prot prayers requires much more skillful play to get better results.

Yeah DoA is not for beginners, but what's that has to do with prot prayer?

Or can you give a elite mission/dungeon that got more counter spirit/anti chant than enchantment removal?

I have a IMBAGON, I can safely say it's IMBA in most of the situation, along with ST. It's much easier to use and protect the whole group at once and better than prot prayer in most of the condition, just elite areas like DOA make this problem obviously. As for condition/hex removal/healing, a healing prayer monk can do a better job than prot prayer, actually with 90%+ damage reduction, you don't even need to worry much about these problem in most of the situation, even a hero healing monk can do the job well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outerworld

That just means ST and Imba needs nerfing, not Prot needs buffing which I think is the point you seem to have missed.

Like I said before, nerf these skills may let new players and random groups have some trouble run DoA, at least not that effective.

ZephyLynx · Aug 03, 2011, 10:14 PM // 22:14

I think you missed my point.

Prot prayers may not be as good as ST/Imba in DoA (the ONLY elite area that you mention), but that does not mean a buff is needed in general, only DoA has a lot of anti-enchant. Prot monks are good in nearly EVERY OTHER place.

If you feel that DoA is very anti-monk, then a better solution would be to change DoA, not the monk.

Unless monks are outclassed by ST/Imba in MOST OTHER AREAS, I don't see this as justification that prot prayers should be buffed (at least in the fashion you speak of).

Edit:

There are a few other points. ST/Imba are specialized builds. ST cannot really be run in conjunction with minions, as minions tend to eat up all the triggers. Imba cannot protect well against armor-ignoring damage (3 x E-Surges from a group of roaring ethers). Also imba is vulnerable to blind, block, slow hexes, adrenaline denial, etc... I'm not saying that these builds are bad, but they are just specialized. A prot monk has much more flexibility.

Actually, when I organize a group, I tend to bring a lot characters with mid-line damage mitigation (P-Instability, Panic, weakness, blind, etc...) and I am the only support character running hybrid monk. With a ST/Imba setup, you still need a dedicated healer, or at least another character with healing skills. Of course, I don't use this setup in DoA, but that's just one of MANY areas in GW.

Slowpokeking · Aug 03, 2011, 10:22 PM // 22:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZephyLynx

I think you missed my point.

Prot prayers may not be as good as ST/Imba in DoA (the ONLY elite area that you mention), but that does not mean a buff is needed in general, only DoA has a lot of anti-enchant. Prot monks are good in nearly EVERY OTHER place.

If you feel that DoA is very anti-monk, then a better solution would be to change DoA, not the monk.

Unless monks are outclassed by ST/Imba in MOST OTHER AREAS, I don't see this as justification that prot prayers should be buffed (at least in the fashion you speak of).

What I'm saying is overall, IMBA/ST>prot prayer in most of the places because

Most of the mobs got more enchantment removal than counter spirit/anti chant skills. DoA is just an example. If I have time I can list about these skills of mobs in other elite missions.

Chants/Spirits affect the whole group at once, most of the prot prayers only affect 1 target at a time, including most of the elites.

I'm not saying it should be brought to the same IMBA level of IMBA/ST, just need some buff to be able to effect the whole group at once and make it not that easy to get removed by change some mobs' skills bars.

Quote:

There are a few other points. ST/Imba are specialized builds. ST cannot really be run in conjunction with minions, as minions tend to eat up all the triggers. Imba cannot protect well against armor-ignoring damage (3 x E-Surges from a group of roaring ethers). Also imba is vulnerable to blind, block, slow hexes, adrenaline denial, etc... I'm not saying that these builds are bad, but they are just specialized. A prot monk has much more flexibility.

Actually, when I organize a group, I tend to bring a lot characters with mid-line damage mitigation (P-Instability, Panic, weakness, blind, etc...) and I am the only support character running hybrid monk. With a ST/Imba setup, you still need a dedicated healer, or at least another character with healing skills. Of course, I don't use this setup in DoA, but that's just one of MANY areas in GW.

As for armor ignoring damage, There is Nothing to Fear also provide 30% damage reduction to the group, but most prot prayer skills can only protect 1 at a time.

With FA/For Great Justice(I also bring a para hero with Anthem of Fury) and some decent hex/condition removal it's not a problem in most of the situation. Signet of Aggression can also build up some adrenaline when I need to. Most of the situation don't bring much trouble to IMBAGON.

Yeah a healer is still needed, then a healing monk will be a better choice.

The Drunkard · Aug 03, 2011, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

They can have more choices, easier to get in rather than have to run some other builds.

Yeah hero is possible, but it's pretty hard for newbies, especially Foundry.

People still failed DoA with ursan back before it was nerfed, people who don't want to learn an elite area and do it because they think they can make a quick buck will always fail, no matter how much prot gets buffed.

There is a reason there is so much caster-hate in DoA- it was because at the time at it's release people were complaining that everything was so easy (IE: Shitterflame meta).

The areas are ELITE FOR A REASON.There are plenty of ways that people can clear the DoA with little to no experience (DwG, ursan, and keystone to name a few). Please stop using the "newbs can't get into groups!" argument. If people do not want to run builds because they don't have the builds or don't have the skills, then they shouldn't be trying beat elite areas in the first place. If anything, it should be wars and rangers that should be buffed (or in your case broken)- they have almost no use in DoA.

Imba's and STs are there to pad less experienced groups from failure. They serve no purpose in experienced groups because there's no need for them. SCs use Emos for bonds because they actually know how to pull mobs. Monks are there for combat rezzes and seed.

Finally, please try and understand each of the classes roles. Imbagons and STs are there to relieve pressure from the backline, prot monks are to stop spikes and redbar. Neither roles can out-do the other in opposite positions.

Outerworld · Aug 03, 2011, 11:53 PM // 23:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Like I said before, nerf these skills may let new players and random groups have some trouble run DoA, at least not that effective.

This is the same "New players find DoA hard" reasoning which you just can't use to justify a buff over a nerf. Also it makes no sense to buff a line because it'a lackluster in one area as ZephyLynx said earlier.

Slowpokeking · Aug 04, 2011, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

People still failed DoA with ursan back before it was nerfed, people who don't want to learn an elite area and do it because they think they can make a quick buck will always fail, no matter how much prot gets buffed.

There is a reason there is so much caster-hate in DoA- it was because at the time at it's release people were complaining that everything was so easy (IE: Shitterflame meta).

The areas are ELITE FOR A REASON.There are plenty of ways that people can clear the DoA with little to no experience (DwG, ursan, and keystone to name a few). Please stop using the "newbs can't get into groups!" argument. If people do not want to run builds because they don't have the builds or don't have the skills, then they shouldn't be trying beat elite areas in the first place. If anything, it should be wars and rangers that should be buffed (or in your case broken)- they have almost no use in DoA.

Imba's and STs are there to pad less experienced groups from failure. They serve no purpose in experienced groups because there's no need for them. SCs use Emos for bonds because they actually know how to pull mobs. Monks are there for combat rezzes and seed.

Finally, please try and understand each of the classes roles. Imbagons and STs are there to relieve pressure from the backline, prot monks are to stop spikes and redbar. Neither roles can out-do the other in opposite positions.

I ran DoA with heroes, I can say it's a lot harder and slower than run it with DWG groups. You can't blame newbies for not be able to run DoA with heroes, especially Foundry.

Then why should IMBA be the right build for DoA and prot prayer not? Becuase it's elite so it should be super unfriendly to prot prayers than IMBA/ST? Sure war/ranger also should be able to do more in DoA, but prot prayer need some works, too. You can go to DoA and look at the chat, see how many people want a prot monk and how many want IMBA/ST.

Come on IMBAGON/ST can stop the whole group from spikes and redbar. In most of the NM mission areas my heroes(some of them don't have runes/insig) won't even drop to 75%. In elite missions IMBA also prove 90% damage reduction, with ST it's almost impossible to nuke, at least better than 99% of the prot prayer skills.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outerworld

This is the same "New players find DoA hard" reasoning which you just can't use to justify a buff over a nerf. Also it makes no sense to buff a line because it'a lackluster in one area as ZephyLynx said earlier.

I always prefer buff rather than nerf because more people will QQ when something get nerfed.

Plutoman · Aug 04, 2011, 01:46 AM // 01:46

It's amazing how many people just want buffs, and more buffs. :/ We're not hitting the easy button for the elite areas - they're already plenty easy enough with experience.

A player that can just complete the game NM should still not be able to beat the elite areas.. They're elite, a small minority should be able to complete. Those that want to complete it should understand that they need to play well to complete it, not get it handed to them.

If they want to play well, they should do all the numerous other things. Tons of stuff. Trenchway says hi to a prot prayers buff. Jesus, it's already way more powerful than a healing monk in a PvE setting.. No way does it need buffed.

Fate Crusher · Aug 04, 2011, 02:22 AM // 02:22

I spent 15 minutes replying to some comments until I realised that I'm still furious with this thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Except bonders, it's not strong compare to IMBAGON and ST.

Why are you agreeing that people rely on IMBAGON and ST too much but still refuse to buff prot prayer?

I already gave ideas about how to buff it.

Ideas. Yes. Congratulations. I once had an idea of a tiger with wings that used to sing my lullabies. My point? You have no reason. There is no point to buff Protection prayers. Why specifically only Prot prayers?

I don't get it, you want to stop ST/Imbagons being the prots in high end PvE by buffing prot prayers and leave ST/Imagons as they are? How old are you?

You're complaining about DoA. About how enchantment removal means bonding based protting is not viable. Your suggestions, as audacious and uselessly overpowered as they are, still don't assess the problem of multiple ench strips.

Want to know why bonding is not viable? You don't have 8 pips of energy regen.

Want to know why this thread fails? This game was always designed for PvP and with attribute lines to have specific purposes. It may have been watered down over the years, with the constant power creep (thanks to whining PvE players like yourself), but you cannot have godly powers like you're suggesting. Don't ruin Guild Wars for what it is, PvE skills have already done enough of splitting the formats apart.

This thread has no obective. First Prot prayers needs a buff, then it's complaining ST/imbagons are too strong, then it's too much ench strip in DoA. You say it's evident in other elite missions? Explain to me why E/Mo Renewal prot heros are more popular than regular monks.

tl dr: I wouldn't employ you to balance my game.

Slowpokeking · Aug 04, 2011, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fate Crusher

I spent 15 minutes replying to some comments until I realised that I'm still furious with this thread.

Ideas. Yes. Congratulations. I once had an idea of a tiger with wings that used to sing my lullabies. My point? You have no reason. There is no point to buff Protection prayers. Why specifically only Prot prayers?

I don't get it, you want to stop ST/Imbagons being the prots in high end PvE by buffing prot prayers and leave ST/Imagons as they are? How old are you?

You're complaining about DoA. About how enchantment removal means bonding based protting is not viable. Your suggestions, as audacious and uselessly overpowered as they are, still don't assess the problem of multiple ench strips.

Want to know why bonding is not viable? You don't have 8 pips of energy regen.

Want to know why this thread fails? This game was always designed for PvP and with attribute lines to have specific purposes. It may have been watered down over the years, with the constant power creep (thanks to whining PvE players like yourself), but you cannot have godly powers like you're suggesting. Don't ruin Guild Wars for what it is, PvE skills have already done enough of splitting the formats apart.

This thread has no obective. First Prot prayers needs a buff, then it's complaining ST/imbagons are too strong, then it's too much ench strip in DoA. You say it's evident in other elite missions? Explain to me why E/Mo Renewal prot heros are more popular than regular monks.

tl dr: I wouldn't employ you to balance my game.

I already gave out my reasons.

Most of the prot prayers only work on 1 target at a time.

Is group affecting damage reduction needed? Of course, because most of the mobs got strong AOE.

Plus

IMBA/ST provide strong group affecting damage reduction. They also got other advantages such as

Not easy to remove compare to enchantment. if you disagree, welcome to give an example of one elite mission/area that got more counter spirit/anti chant skills than enchantment removal.

They can keep the damage reduction for a long while compare to many prot prayer skills.

Many elite prot prayers are out of date compare to ST/IMBA skills.

Therefore, my solution is

1 Redo some of the elite mission mob skills bars, remove some of the enchantment removal skills. Right now they got a lot of removal skills. Mallyx totally owns enchantment.

2 Reduce some of the skills' CD such as shielding hands, Aegis and SoA, if necessary, make them cant not be used on 1 target too many times in a short period.

3 Add effect on some of the skills, when you cast on one ally others around him will get some benefit such as

Convert Hexes: Removes all hexes; +10 armor to all part members in the area for each Necromancer hex removed (8...18...20 seconds).

Purifying Veil: Conditions expire 5...41...50% faster on target ally. End effect: removes a condition from all party members in the area.

4 Make some elite skills affect the whole group rather than 1 person, such as LB, Air of Enchantment and Shield of Regeneration. Nerf their effect by a little bit if this make them too powerful.

Such as

Shield of Regeneration: (5...11...13 seconds.) +3...9...10 Health regeneration and +25 armor to all party members in the area.

Life Barrier: Reduces other party members' damage by 15...33...42%. If your Health is below 70% when target takes damage, Life Barrier ends.
5 I just got it, add some effect when it is removed by enemy skills.

Is that godly powers to you? Then you must QQ about IMBA/ST for a long while.

The Drunkard · Aug 04, 2011, 03:45 AM // 03:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

I ran DoA with heroes, I can say it's a lot harder and slower than run it with DWG groups. You can't blame newbies for not be able to run DoA with heroes, especially Foundry.

You're right, I can't blame newbies. But I can blame people who think that sub-optimal bars must be able to clear areas. There's a reason a meta exists...it works.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Then why should IMBA be the right build for DoA and prot prayer not? Becuase it's elite so it should be super unfriendly to prot prayers than IMBA/ST? Sure war/ranger also should be able to do more in DoA, but prot prayer need some works, too. You can go to DoA and look at the chat, see how many people want a prot monk and how many want IMBA/ST.

Back up a second...you're saying that you have problems finding groups because you want to play pure prot?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard;

If people do not want to run builds because they don't have the builds or don't have the skills, then they shouldn't be trying beat elite areas in the first place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Come on IMBAGON/ST can stop the whole group from spikes and redbar.

I'd love to see a redbarring imbagon build, or ST for that matter. Please share.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Shield of Regeneration: (5...11...13 seconds.) +3...9...10 Health regeneration and +25 armor to all party members in the area.

Is that godly powers to you? Then you must QQ about IMBA/ST for a long while.

Sorry, I'm done here.

/notsigned

Slowpokeking · Aug 04, 2011, 03:53 AM // 03:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

You're right, I can't blame newbies. But I can blame people who think that sub-optimal bars must be able to clear areas. There's a reason a meta exists...it works.

The thing is, unless you have a good guild that does not require you. either you have to run the builds that DWG groups ask you to, or you have to run it with heroes.

Quote:

Back up a second...you're saying that you have problems finding groups because you want to play pure prot?

If people do not want to run builds because they don't have the builds or don't have the skills, then they shouldn't be trying beat elite areas in the first place.

Tell me what's wrong for add a good new build to DoA? So you admit that prot prayers do not work in DoA? If Anet never change panic from that "-2 eng deg and damage once enemy use signet" to what we have today, we won't see today's DoA require 1, is it wrong to do so?

Rather than "If you don't run the build then don't try to beat it", isn't it better to be "Let's give other classes/build more spaces in these areas"? Plus, is it wrong to give prot prayers group affecting damage reduction when almost all the high level enemies use AOE?

Quote:

Sorry, I'm done here.

/notsigned

It's just an example, sure it can be rebalanced.
Oh I missed red bars, but spikes can be well prevented.

Plutoman · Aug 04, 2011, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Prot prayers is powerful. If you make it more powerful, it'll be overpowered. Pretty simple. Prot prayers is a line of single target prot that's significantly more effective than a party protect - but only on one person. This is used for tanking, for counteracting melee, etc. I would not enter any difficult area without a method of single prot. I can enter without party protection, because it's not always needed.

Stop griping because there's other builds to be used. In addition, go look at the E/Mo Ether Renewal bar.

And to respond to above, I use prot prayers in the DoA. Quite often. I don't run meta bars, and I don't use an imba. I sometimes use ST. I always use prot prayers. Just because speed clears don't use prot prayers in the DoA (which trenchway does, anyways) doesn't mean prot prayers are underpowered. Please, go start playing guild wars and learn to play instead of griping.

Slowpokeking · Aug 04, 2011, 04:25 AM // 04:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plutoman

Prot prayers is powerful. If you make it more powerful, it'll be overpowered. Pretty simple. Prot prayers is a line of single target prot that's significantly more effective than a party protect - but only on one person. This is used for tanking, for counteracting melee, etc. I would not enter any difficult area without a method of single prot. I can enter without party protection, because it's not always needed.

Stop griping because there's other builds to be used. In addition, go look at the E/Mo Ether Renewal bar.

And to respond to above, I use prot prayers in the DoA. Quite often. I don't run meta bars, and I don't use an imba. I sometimes use ST. I always use prot prayers. Just because speed clears don't use prot prayers in the DoA (which trenchway does, anyways) doesn't mean prot prayers are underpowered. Please, go start playing guild wars and learn to play instead of griping.

Most of the mob groups in the elite missions got strong AOE. and compare to single spike it's more dangerous. ST/IMBA can also provide strong reduction to 1 single target(100 more armor+35% damage reduction+15 damage reduction+cannot not more than 10% HP per hit). Can you tell me why most of the people in DoA chat want IMBA/ST?

So it's only effective on elementalists rather than monks themselves is good?

Stop saying other people don't know how to play.
I will say IMBA/ST is a better choice than prot prayer in DoA from my experiences and I gave the mobs' skills on enchantment removal.
Also I don't run DoA much now but everytime I go there and look on the chat they are asking for IMBA/ST rather than prot monks.

Outerworld · Aug 04, 2011, 08:59 AM // 08:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

I always prefer buff rather than nerf because more people will QQ when something get nerfed.

I can assure you, people will QQ if Prot prayers is buffed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Most of the mob groups in the elite missions got strong AOE. and compare to single spike it's more dangerous.

Aggro control is cool yeah?

Elfblade · Aug 04, 2011, 09:37 AM // 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Rather than "If you don't run the build then don't try to beat it", isn't it better to be "Let's give other classes/build more spaces in these areas"? .

Doa with heroes is possible with every profession, problem is you dont beat with your wammo build. Doa and other elite area's with heroes dont require special builds to finish. What you dont understand is that the builds people suggest have been tested and are countering the skill bars of the mobs. Nobody is stopping/or is being limited by the game to finish doa their way. You dont finish doa heroway with builds but mostly with tactics and strategy's. The problem people need to learn these ''skills''. I dont think it is favourable for the game that all elite area's become a c-space fest as most of guildwars already is.

Your speed clear argument is bs. speedclears always favor certain builds and leave out a majority of the lines. its more or less a FOTM maybe next speed clear your proffession or favorite attribute line is included. buffing stuff just so that it is included in the speed clears is bad, very bad, like power creep bad.

and your skill suggestions, you do not get the point of protection prayers do you. protection prayers is attribute line that requires careful usage. As skills can give you very high yield for the energy you are spending. examples are spirit bond, soa, shielding hands even protective spirit. all these skill if placed correct negate a lot of incoming damage, it is not facerolling over your keyboard because. For enchantment stripping as that seems to be your big problem with using prot prayers. You bring a midline with interupts for that or you cover them. You have so many options now that you can bring 7 heroes to counter the stuff that is thrown at you.

/end rage

JONO51 · Aug 04, 2011, 11:29 AM // 11:29

No reason there is a massive powercreep with this kind of attitude. I mean, you want to buff prot prayers because they can't keep up with an imbagon? RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing seriously? Its called imbagon because its imbalanced herp derp. Nerf imbagon and ST prot spirits and prot prayers instantly becomes more "useful" (not to say it isn't already).

BlackSephir · Aug 04, 2011, 11:43 AM // 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

Nerf these will make many missions harder, I don't think it's a good idea.

You realize that that's the point? To make missions not as steam-rollable?

Fate Crusher · Aug 04, 2011, 12:13 PM // 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

I already gave out my reasons.

Then don't repost them! I've read them already and that was my reply, this will be a never ending circle of idiocy if you keep turning back to your same point ALL OVER AGAIN. Not to mention your suggestions are absurd to say the least.

All you say is that elite areas have strong AoE. Enchants are easier to strip than mindless AI not attack spirits out of range.

Congrats, you're able to point out the obvious. This is plainly a QQ thread asking for stupid buffs.

I should have never gotten into this PvE discussion. Hurr Durr this, Derp that. Ignorance is bliss when you play PvE I guess. Have you even read anyone's explanation about what real Protting can actually accomplish? There are builds and counter builds and in PvE, you're there to make money. DoA is no longer about exploring and having fun, you're trying to farm armbraces. Take the best builds and do it quicker, stop QQing about single target prots when you clearly have no grasp of this game.

Close this thread, he has to be trolling, no one can carry a 3 page long thread on copy + pasting the same argument on every page... If this was another forum, I'd be much less polite.

Slowpokeking · Aug 04, 2011, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elfblade

Doa with heroes is possible with every profession, problem is you dont beat with your wammo build. Doa and other elite area's with heroes dont require special builds to finish. What you dont understand is that the builds people suggest have been tested and are countering the skill bars of the mobs. Nobody is stopping/or is being limited by the game to finish doa their way. You dont finish doa heroway with builds but mostly with tactics and strategy's. The problem people need to learn these ''skills''. I dont think it is favourable for the game that all elite area's become a c-space fest as most of guildwars already is.

Your speed clear argument is bs. speedclears always favor certain builds and leave out a majority of the lines. its more or less a FOTM maybe next speed clear your proffession or favorite attribute line is included. buffing stuff just so that it is included in the speed clears is bad, very bad, like power creep bad.

and your skill suggestions, you do not get the point of protection prayers do you. protection prayers is attribute line that requires careful usage. As skills can give you very high yield for the energy you are spending. examples are spirit bond, soa, shielding hands even protective spirit. all these skill if placed correct negate a lot of incoming damage, it is not facerolling over your keyboard because. For enchantment stripping as that seems to be your big problem with using prot prayers. You bring a midline with interupts for that or you cover them. You have so many options now that you can bring 7 heroes to counter the stuff that is thrown at you.

/end rage

I know you can hero it, but it's much slower and harder for many new players.

I also compared protection prayer with other 2 popular damage reduction. I'm not saying it should be brought to the same level of IMBA/ST, just let some skills be able to bring some benefit when you cast a spell on one target, and let some elite skills be able to affect the group at once because right now they are really out of date I'll say. Is it too much? Prot monks can't even ask for elite group affecting damage reduction skills when AOE is everywhere?
High level area's mob groups all have strong AOE and thus group affecting skills are needed. Is that very bad?

Outerworld · Aug 04, 2011, 03:57 PM // 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slowpokeking

High level area's mob groups all have strong AOE and thus group affecting skills are needed. Is that very bad?

Group affecting skills aren't needed if you execute proper aggro control. DwG get away with balling up in AoE because ST allows them to hence why it should be nerfed rather than bringing Prot up to its level.

So yes; it is very bad.